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<![CDATA[True Support - Welcome to Our Forum!]]> https://www.truesupport.org/forum/ Tue, 14 Jul 2026 08:59:06 +0000 MyBB <![CDATA[Building a relationship with your EMR Partner]]> https://www.truesupport.org/forum/showthread.php?tid=21327 Sat, 28 Jan 2023 23:25:55 +0000 Lily]]> https://www.truesupport.org/forum/showthread.php?tid=21327
Hearing that for the first time can be hurtful and confusing. Isn’t that what all the movies and books have shown us, that if a person loves another, they will change their life to be with that special person?

Unfortunately, it’s not always possible or simple. Their decision to stay married is not because they are choosing between two people. There are many real life struggles and commitments that mean that they can’t leave their marriage. It doesn’t mean that they don’t want to, some do.

If your married person feels this way, or you are the married person reading this, there is hope for a happy and lasting relationship with your special person.

It’s possible to be the primary romantic love in an EMR. When you are the primary love in each others’ lives, there is the potential for a long and beautiful relationship to form and grow as it remains as an EMR.

Some of the happiest EMRs I have seen are the ones where the spouse has the familial love and the EMR partner has the romantic love and emotional intimacy. This can happen when the EMR partners clearly define their relationship and agree on the type of relationship they both want together. The EMR will get nurtured more than the marriage at times by the married partner which shows a commitment to the EMR and their partner.

It doesn’t mean there won’t be difficult times together or hurt feelings but you will work through it together with honesty and communication because your EMR deserves the love and attention. You deserve to be happy and that happiness may be found in your EMR partner.

Welcome to our safe place where you will not be judged, we’re thankful you found us.]]>
Hearing that for the first time can be hurtful and confusing. Isn’t that what all the movies and books have shown us, that if a person loves another, they will change their life to be with that special person?

Unfortunately, it’s not always possible or simple. Their decision to stay married is not because they are choosing between two people. There are many real life struggles and commitments that mean that they can’t leave their marriage. It doesn’t mean that they don’t want to, some do.

If your married person feels this way, or you are the married person reading this, there is hope for a happy and lasting relationship with your special person.

It’s possible to be the primary romantic love in an EMR. When you are the primary love in each others’ lives, there is the potential for a long and beautiful relationship to form and grow as it remains as an EMR.

Some of the happiest EMRs I have seen are the ones where the spouse has the familial love and the EMR partner has the romantic love and emotional intimacy. This can happen when the EMR partners clearly define their relationship and agree on the type of relationship they both want together. The EMR will get nurtured more than the marriage at times by the married partner which shows a commitment to the EMR and their partner.

It doesn’t mean there won’t be difficult times together or hurt feelings but you will work through it together with honesty and communication because your EMR deserves the love and attention. You deserve to be happy and that happiness may be found in your EMR partner.

Welcome to our safe place where you will not be judged, we’re thankful you found us.]]> <![CDATA[Sometimes the extra-marital relationship (EMR) is the healthier relationship]]> https://www.truesupport.org/forum/showthread.php?tid=21325 Sat, 28 Jan 2023 19:03:49 +0000 Harlow]]> https://www.truesupport.org/forum/showthread.php?tid=21325
I thought I would share that sometimes the extra-marital relationship is healthier than the marriage relationship. It doesn’t mean the MP (married person) will divorce for something healthier but that doesn’t mean the dynamic in the marriage was better either. Maybe it was just easier.

When my MM (married man) was going through his separation and was feeling conflicted, he invited me to his counseling sessions. I was surprised how much his IC (Individual Counselor) shared with me from prior sessions. Apparently they talked a lot about me as well as BW (Betrayed Wife) and through these discussions the IC concluded that our R (relationship) was the healthier one because our dynamic was to solve problems and move forward with an intention of not repeating unhealthy patterns or do any rug-sweeping. I wanted a healthier R than what I had in my M (marriage) and my MM agreed that he wanted that, too.

Gable, my MM, found these tools to be healthy and enlightening but it took hard work and fortitude, which I think he eventually tired of. He ultimately found himself back in his comfort zone of codependency and rug-sweeping in the M but we enjoyed a very lovely and long term R for many years after he and BW reconciled, which I don’t regret. It was a beautiful ride of nearly two decades.

It’s important to note that he chose himself. It wasn’t about choosing a woman. In the end he kept both, both kept him in his happy place.

I knew he would need encouragement to stand up for himself if he was going to return to his M, so I kept providing that. He recently shared that he stood up to BW, that he would respond better to her if she simply asked for things rather than her usual approach. I was proud of him for that!

We should learn from every relationship we have in life whether it be parent/child, husband/wife, employee/employer, or married person/other person. We learn from each and take what we learn into the next relationship, strengthening ourselves with each relational journey. Gable learned to stand up to BW; I learned to walk away from someone I still loved.

Have no regrets, because all Rs enrich our lives and teach us more about ourselves and that can be a beautiful journey in itself.

I am divorced now, and have left Gable. I walked away from both Rs with an immense amount of strength and agency to move forward to better things.]]>
I thought I would share that sometimes the extra-marital relationship is healthier than the marriage relationship. It doesn’t mean the MP (married person) will divorce for something healthier but that doesn’t mean the dynamic in the marriage was better either. Maybe it was just easier.

When my MM (married man) was going through his separation and was feeling conflicted, he invited me to his counseling sessions. I was surprised how much his IC (Individual Counselor) shared with me from prior sessions. Apparently they talked a lot about me as well as BW (Betrayed Wife) and through these discussions the IC concluded that our R (relationship) was the healthier one because our dynamic was to solve problems and move forward with an intention of not repeating unhealthy patterns or do any rug-sweeping. I wanted a healthier R than what I had in my M (marriage) and my MM agreed that he wanted that, too.

Gable, my MM, found these tools to be healthy and enlightening but it took hard work and fortitude, which I think he eventually tired of. He ultimately found himself back in his comfort zone of codependency and rug-sweeping in the M but we enjoyed a very lovely and long term R for many years after he and BW reconciled, which I don’t regret. It was a beautiful ride of nearly two decades.

It’s important to note that he chose himself. It wasn’t about choosing a woman. In the end he kept both, both kept him in his happy place.

I knew he would need encouragement to stand up for himself if he was going to return to his M, so I kept providing that. He recently shared that he stood up to BW, that he would respond better to her if she simply asked for things rather than her usual approach. I was proud of him for that!

We should learn from every relationship we have in life whether it be parent/child, husband/wife, employee/employer, or married person/other person. We learn from each and take what we learn into the next relationship, strengthening ourselves with each relational journey. Gable learned to stand up to BW; I learned to walk away from someone I still loved.

Have no regrets, because all Rs enrich our lives and teach us more about ourselves and that can be a beautiful journey in itself.

I am divorced now, and have left Gable. I walked away from both Rs with an immense amount of strength and agency to move forward to better things.]]> <![CDATA[2023 - 12th Year of True Support]]> https://www.truesupport.org/forum/showthread.php?tid=21321 Fri, 27 Jan 2023 15:16:14 +0000 Mod Team]]> https://www.truesupport.org/forum/showthread.php?tid=21321
Welcome

Join True Support]]>
Welcome

Join True Support]]> <![CDATA[My journey to the other side]]> https://www.truesupport.org/forum/showthread.php?tid=20117 Mon, 07 Sep 2020 15:36:14 +0000 judys]]> https://www.truesupport.org/forum/showthread.php?tid=20117
I met my now husband, I'll call him Ben, and his BW when he became a customer of mine at a business I owned. I was instantly attracted to him and the chemical reaction between us was palpable. I became friends with them both. I wasn't too keen on BW but I stayed friendly in order to keep him in my life on a social basis. I was very intrigued by him and I liked being around him. Also, our children were the same age and became very good friends. It was clear that we were both unfulfilled in our relationships, both just bumping along, not massively unhappy but bored of a life devoid of passion and romance. I never once saw any affection between them at all, they just acted like friends, as did me and my then partner.

Throughout the next couple of years, whilst we had never discussed our feelings, the attraction was clear. We texted all the time, often making very obvious innuendos and they were certainly beyond what we would have allowed our partners to see, so I guess we were kind of having an emotional EMR of sorts by then. I was obsessed with him, so deeply in love like I had never felt before. I thought about him all the time and was only ever happy when I was with him or talking to him. I didn't know how I could ever be happy again because he could never be mine. I was so in love with Ben that I left my four-year relationship. He was a nice man who was good with my kids but I didn't love him and it wasn't fair on him (sidenote: he is now happily married with a child of his own.)

I ended up moving into a new house just down the road from Ben and his family, not on purpose, but it was literally the only suitable house available for rent in the town. After that we became closer than ever, his BW would often go away for the weekend and leave him with the kids so he would come and spend all his time with me and mine. Sometimes it felt like we were a family. But then she would come home and the reality would hit like a train. He wasn't mine and he was going nowhere. Nothing had ever happened between us and we still hadn't discussed our feelings. I tried to hate him, talk myself into believing that he didn't love me and that he just enjoyed the ego boost from knowing that I was so into him. I dated a friend of mine to try and get over him, but it didn't work. Then, three years after we had met, we bumped into each other on a night out. BW went home early and we drank and danced the night away. Whilst walking home, in the middle of us laughing and joking, I just blurted it out that I was totally in love with him. After a moment of total fear, to my surprise, I was swept up into a passionate embrace. We kissed for a long time and then he told me that he had been deeply in love with me for a long time. I suppose I knew really, but he was much better at hiding it than me. However, he also told me that he couldn't bear to leave the family home because of his children. I went from euphoria to devastation in minutes. He did love me, but he would never be truly mine. So, an EMR began.

After this point we discussed his M and all that was wrong. There was no physical intimacy and even when there had been he had been unfulfilled. We on the other hand were certainly sexually compatible which made us pretty much symbiotic in every way possible. The chemistry, love and bond between us was like nothing we had ever felt before. BW became suspicious. She never said anything to me but she would question him a lot. In fact, she tried to become very friendly with me, but I knew why and remained cautious. There were a few close calls but we were quite clever so never got caught and she was still going off on her many social jaunts so it was quite easy to see each other regularly.

Months into the EMR and I was in a constant state of elation and despair. I hated not having him as my own and I was also petrified of being found out. Everything was on the line, my business, our children and their friendships, all of our friends. Everyone knew everyone and BW was very popular in the town. But despite all of this I remained deeply committed, the love I had for him superseded all the guilt and fear. Then one day Ben said he could take it no longer and told me he was going to leave BW. It was no easy task. BW did what many do and pulled out all the stops to stop him leaving. The whole process took months and was very stressful for all involved. BW tried to get them to counselling, tried sleeping with him again, told him to never tell her again that he didn't love her anymore and would often fly into uncontrollable emotional outbursts that would range from hysteria to anger. She even punched him once. But he persevered, moved into the spare room and then eventually into his own flat down the road. We fully intended to keep our R a secret for as long as possible but, the town being what it is, days in I was spotted leaving his flat early in the morning and literally, all hell erupted.

I was now the Scarlett woman about town, my business suffered, I was verbally and even once physically abused. I even had to get the police involved. I was actually scared to go out without my kids as I knew when I had them with me I would be left alone. But, the love for him remained strong and no matter how tough things got, the fact that he was now mine made it worth it.

So then we were in an OR and this is the part I want you to know about. ORs that emerge from EMRs are not the same as normal relationships when they start. You have to be absolutely sure, deeply committed, very strong minded and most importantly, extremely patient. That said, if you are in an EMR then you probably already are as we all know what patience it takes to be in one! The children were relatively positive about us, especially as they were already friends, but Ben's children did struggle for a long time. I was close to them, so they were fine with me, but they obviously wanted their mum and dad back together. All of his friends were married to BW's friends so he lost them all. My friends remained loyal but even though they all loved Ben, he didn't feel like they were his friends in the same sense. I know he found this very hard. When he was married to BW, he went out a lot, always socialising and, as a very social person myself, I really looked forward to socialising as a couple. But that wasn't to be. He no longer wanted to go out at the weekends. This was partly so he didn't see people, her family, ex friends etc but also because it turned out that he only went out so much because he was so unhappy at home and he also wanted to see me! But now he had me, he just wanted to stay in, in our little safe bubble. I missed my social life a lot, but the fact was that just too many people now hated us to make a night out locally enjoyable. The divorce was long and messy. When he got the letter to say it was over, I was over the moon but he was very quiet for a few days which sent me into a tailspin. But he assured me that it wasn't regret, just that he felt a bit like a failure, and guilty. I got it though, as I remembered feeling that very same feeling when I left the father of my children. Even though you want to leave, there is still a great deal of sadness and guilt about it all, especially when you share children. I had to put my feelings aside and be patient and understanding.

For a long time our relationship was full of unbridled, raw passion but also very major blow ups. We had everything against us and many people tried their hardest to break us up. It took a lot of endurance to weather those storms. He also refused to acknowledge my existence on social media. If anyone tagged us in a photo, he would hide it and he wouldn't change his relationship status. I found this extremely hard. I had felt like the hidden guilty secret for so long and I didn't want to still feel like that now that we were in an OR. Many people who we both knew had deleted me from SM but not him and I knew he didn't want them antagonised. But I felt that if they didn't want to see pictures of us on his SM then they should remove themselves from his friends list. Eventually, at least two years in, he changed his relationship status to in a relationship with me, and he allowed all the hidden photos of us on to his wall, but I could tell he was nervous about it. It's all these little things that you do in a normal R that are so much more difficult in an OR from an EMR.

Another thing worth noting is that if you are the OW, EVERYONE will blame you for the break up, not the MM! It also means that BW now has a scapegoat from reflecting on any of the mistakes she may have made during the marriage and are able to direct 100% of the blame solely on to you. They convince themselves that, but for you, everyone would have lived happily ever after, despite the fact that deep down, everyone was living a thoroughly vacuous and middle-class life, all rosey looking on the surface but with no substance or depth underneath. As my wonderful late father always said, 'you can't take a man who doesn't want to be taken.'

So now we have been together for nearly six years. We are married and own our own home a few miles out of the town were everyone still hates us! I'm afraid the resentment never goes away, I guess I was naive believing that over time it would. Funnily enough, our neighbours got together in the same way we did and are also very happily married now, so we are close to them for obvious reasons! The day after we got married, Ben changed his profile picture to us on our wedding day - the first time in four years he put a pic of us up! To be fair to him though, he really doesn't like or use it very often and he never did post much anyway. I closed my business a couple of years ago and am happily back in a profession I used to do and love my job very much. We are blessed to have a comfortable lifestyle and all the children get on amazingly and are very happy. We love each other very deeply, we never argue anymore and our intimate life is still great.

But do know this, the feelings you experience during an EMR will never continue into an OR long term. At times, I have felt a bit lost and I think that is because you spend so long wanting and trying to move towards the goal of a normal OR that when you get there, you think all that intensity, that yearning, that passion, that you only get from an EMR will continue, but the reality is that it just doesn't. Life becomes normal, it has to, and the problems that EMRs don't have, such as housework, plumbing problems and paying bills etc, become part of your new relationship. When you are in an EMR, te time you spend together is intense, you cherish it, you laugh and cry and make mad passionate love and then spend all your time yearning and planning for the next time. That naturally comes to an end once in an OR.

You must also be 100% sure that when you become the new partner or spouse, you are not creating a vacancy for another OW or OM. The nature of the beginning of your OR can be the cause of a great deal of insecurity. This is not the case for us, especially not now, but there have been occasions of insecurity on both sides in the past. So you must be sure that you got together because you both fell in love and are both fully committed to each other, not because one or both of you were trying to fill a void because of boredom and lack of sex etc in your relationships. There is simply no point in going through all that pain and anguish if the chapter is just going to repeat itself and you yourself stand a chance of becoming the BW further down the line.

So was the grass greener? Yes, very much so. My life has changed so much though. We still have very few friends and I still sometimes miss the excitement and passion of the EMR. But when I do, I remind myself of all the pain I felt when he had to leave, how I dreamt of waking up next to him every day, of cooking for him, of marrying him, of both of us coming home from work and talking about our day, in person and not via text. When we on away together, I remind myself of the anguish I felt when he was away with xBW. So I look at him lying next to me and am so very grateful, my heart still skips a beat every time he walks into the room and I will love him dearly until the day I die.

I am a success story, but it hasn't been easy and I am probably in a minority. If you are going to transition, be cautious, be certain, but above all, be very, very patient.

Love to you all xxx]]>
I met my now husband, I'll call him Ben, and his BW when he became a customer of mine at a business I owned. I was instantly attracted to him and the chemical reaction between us was palpable. I became friends with them both. I wasn't too keen on BW but I stayed friendly in order to keep him in my life on a social basis. I was very intrigued by him and I liked being around him. Also, our children were the same age and became very good friends. It was clear that we were both unfulfilled in our relationships, both just bumping along, not massively unhappy but bored of a life devoid of passion and romance. I never once saw any affection between them at all, they just acted like friends, as did me and my then partner.

Throughout the next couple of years, whilst we had never discussed our feelings, the attraction was clear. We texted all the time, often making very obvious innuendos and they were certainly beyond what we would have allowed our partners to see, so I guess we were kind of having an emotional EMR of sorts by then. I was obsessed with him, so deeply in love like I had never felt before. I thought about him all the time and was only ever happy when I was with him or talking to him. I didn't know how I could ever be happy again because he could never be mine. I was so in love with Ben that I left my four-year relationship. He was a nice man who was good with my kids but I didn't love him and it wasn't fair on him (sidenote: he is now happily married with a child of his own.)

I ended up moving into a new house just down the road from Ben and his family, not on purpose, but it was literally the only suitable house available for rent in the town. After that we became closer than ever, his BW would often go away for the weekend and leave him with the kids so he would come and spend all his time with me and mine. Sometimes it felt like we were a family. But then she would come home and the reality would hit like a train. He wasn't mine and he was going nowhere. Nothing had ever happened between us and we still hadn't discussed our feelings. I tried to hate him, talk myself into believing that he didn't love me and that he just enjoyed the ego boost from knowing that I was so into him. I dated a friend of mine to try and get over him, but it didn't work. Then, three years after we had met, we bumped into each other on a night out. BW went home early and we drank and danced the night away. Whilst walking home, in the middle of us laughing and joking, I just blurted it out that I was totally in love with him. After a moment of total fear, to my surprise, I was swept up into a passionate embrace. We kissed for a long time and then he told me that he had been deeply in love with me for a long time. I suppose I knew really, but he was much better at hiding it than me. However, he also told me that he couldn't bear to leave the family home because of his children. I went from euphoria to devastation in minutes. He did love me, but he would never be truly mine. So, an EMR began.

After this point we discussed his M and all that was wrong. There was no physical intimacy and even when there had been he had been unfulfilled. We on the other hand were certainly sexually compatible which made us pretty much symbiotic in every way possible. The chemistry, love and bond between us was like nothing we had ever felt before. BW became suspicious. She never said anything to me but she would question him a lot. In fact, she tried to become very friendly with me, but I knew why and remained cautious. There were a few close calls but we were quite clever so never got caught and she was still going off on her many social jaunts so it was quite easy to see each other regularly.

Months into the EMR and I was in a constant state of elation and despair. I hated not having him as my own and I was also petrified of being found out. Everything was on the line, my business, our children and their friendships, all of our friends. Everyone knew everyone and BW was very popular in the town. But despite all of this I remained deeply committed, the love I had for him superseded all the guilt and fear. Then one day Ben said he could take it no longer and told me he was going to leave BW. It was no easy task. BW did what many do and pulled out all the stops to stop him leaving. The whole process took months and was very stressful for all involved. BW tried to get them to counselling, tried sleeping with him again, told him to never tell her again that he didn't love her anymore and would often fly into uncontrollable emotional outbursts that would range from hysteria to anger. She even punched him once. But he persevered, moved into the spare room and then eventually into his own flat down the road. We fully intended to keep our R a secret for as long as possible but, the town being what it is, days in I was spotted leaving his flat early in the morning and literally, all hell erupted.

I was now the Scarlett woman about town, my business suffered, I was verbally and even once physically abused. I even had to get the police involved. I was actually scared to go out without my kids as I knew when I had them with me I would be left alone. But, the love for him remained strong and no matter how tough things got, the fact that he was now mine made it worth it.

So then we were in an OR and this is the part I want you to know about. ORs that emerge from EMRs are not the same as normal relationships when they start. You have to be absolutely sure, deeply committed, very strong minded and most importantly, extremely patient. That said, if you are in an EMR then you probably already are as we all know what patience it takes to be in one! The children were relatively positive about us, especially as they were already friends, but Ben's children did struggle for a long time. I was close to them, so they were fine with me, but they obviously wanted their mum and dad back together. All of his friends were married to BW's friends so he lost them all. My friends remained loyal but even though they all loved Ben, he didn't feel like they were his friends in the same sense. I know he found this very hard. When he was married to BW, he went out a lot, always socialising and, as a very social person myself, I really looked forward to socialising as a couple. But that wasn't to be. He no longer wanted to go out at the weekends. This was partly so he didn't see people, her family, ex friends etc but also because it turned out that he only went out so much because he was so unhappy at home and he also wanted to see me! But now he had me, he just wanted to stay in, in our little safe bubble. I missed my social life a lot, but the fact was that just too many people now hated us to make a night out locally enjoyable. The divorce was long and messy. When he got the letter to say it was over, I was over the moon but he was very quiet for a few days which sent me into a tailspin. But he assured me that it wasn't regret, just that he felt a bit like a failure, and guilty. I got it though, as I remembered feeling that very same feeling when I left the father of my children. Even though you want to leave, there is still a great deal of sadness and guilt about it all, especially when you share children. I had to put my feelings aside and be patient and understanding.

For a long time our relationship was full of unbridled, raw passion but also very major blow ups. We had everything against us and many people tried their hardest to break us up. It took a lot of endurance to weather those storms. He also refused to acknowledge my existence on social media. If anyone tagged us in a photo, he would hide it and he wouldn't change his relationship status. I found this extremely hard. I had felt like the hidden guilty secret for so long and I didn't want to still feel like that now that we were in an OR. Many people who we both knew had deleted me from SM but not him and I knew he didn't want them antagonised. But I felt that if they didn't want to see pictures of us on his SM then they should remove themselves from his friends list. Eventually, at least two years in, he changed his relationship status to in a relationship with me, and he allowed all the hidden photos of us on to his wall, but I could tell he was nervous about it. It's all these little things that you do in a normal R that are so much more difficult in an OR from an EMR.

Another thing worth noting is that if you are the OW, EVERYONE will blame you for the break up, not the MM! It also means that BW now has a scapegoat from reflecting on any of the mistakes she may have made during the marriage and are able to direct 100% of the blame solely on to you. They convince themselves that, but for you, everyone would have lived happily ever after, despite the fact that deep down, everyone was living a thoroughly vacuous and middle-class life, all rosey looking on the surface but with no substance or depth underneath. As my wonderful late father always said, 'you can't take a man who doesn't want to be taken.'

So now we have been together for nearly six years. We are married and own our own home a few miles out of the town were everyone still hates us! I'm afraid the resentment never goes away, I guess I was naive believing that over time it would. Funnily enough, our neighbours got together in the same way we did and are also very happily married now, so we are close to them for obvious reasons! The day after we got married, Ben changed his profile picture to us on our wedding day - the first time in four years he put a pic of us up! To be fair to him though, he really doesn't like or use it very often and he never did post much anyway. I closed my business a couple of years ago and am happily back in a profession I used to do and love my job very much. We are blessed to have a comfortable lifestyle and all the children get on amazingly and are very happy. We love each other very deeply, we never argue anymore and our intimate life is still great.

But do know this, the feelings you experience during an EMR will never continue into an OR long term. At times, I have felt a bit lost and I think that is because you spend so long wanting and trying to move towards the goal of a normal OR that when you get there, you think all that intensity, that yearning, that passion, that you only get from an EMR will continue, but the reality is that it just doesn't. Life becomes normal, it has to, and the problems that EMRs don't have, such as housework, plumbing problems and paying bills etc, become part of your new relationship. When you are in an EMR, te time you spend together is intense, you cherish it, you laugh and cry and make mad passionate love and then spend all your time yearning and planning for the next time. That naturally comes to an end once in an OR.

You must also be 100% sure that when you become the new partner or spouse, you are not creating a vacancy for another OW or OM. The nature of the beginning of your OR can be the cause of a great deal of insecurity. This is not the case for us, especially not now, but there have been occasions of insecurity on both sides in the past. So you must be sure that you got together because you both fell in love and are both fully committed to each other, not because one or both of you were trying to fill a void because of boredom and lack of sex etc in your relationships. There is simply no point in going through all that pain and anguish if the chapter is just going to repeat itself and you yourself stand a chance of becoming the BW further down the line.

So was the grass greener? Yes, very much so. My life has changed so much though. We still have very few friends and I still sometimes miss the excitement and passion of the EMR. But when I do, I remind myself of all the pain I felt when he had to leave, how I dreamt of waking up next to him every day, of cooking for him, of marrying him, of both of us coming home from work and talking about our day, in person and not via text. When we on away together, I remind myself of the anguish I felt when he was away with xBW. So I look at him lying next to me and am so very grateful, my heart still skips a beat every time he walks into the room and I will love him dearly until the day I die.

I am a success story, but it hasn't been easy and I am probably in a minority. If you are going to transition, be cautious, be certain, but above all, be very, very patient.

Love to you all xxx]]> <![CDATA[Happy & Content.]]> https://www.truesupport.org/forum/showthread.php?tid=15611 Mon, 20 Aug 2018 09:48:37 +0000 Irene Adler]]> https://www.truesupport.org/forum/showthread.php?tid=15611
Yes, it does happen and more often than we might think, given the large canon of accepted dogma on the subject. All promoting the stereotypical negative version of EMR's (extra marital relationship) and OP's (other person). The one we see repeated in all mainstream media and on most "support" sites for OP's.

Well, I'm here to tell you that negative cliche is not true in my case. I suspect there are many of us Happy OP's around. Why don't we hear about those ? I think because, in the main, happy, content people don't join support forums .. or they get run off/put off by the negative bias & reception given to OP's on most of those forums. Except True Support of course!

So, am I devoid of morals, empathy? Am I needy, lacking self-esteem, a bitch, a traitor to the 'sister-hood' , narcissistic, sociopath, addicted, .. err what else .. a fantasist, being used, a doormat .. on and on I could go.
The answer is NO. I'm a normal woman who fell in love. That I fell in love with a married man was my misfortune ,and, I discovered, a jewel of (self) discovery, love & delight.

I took a "road less taken" .. and like most roads less taken it went meandering, sometimes into dark, unlit spaces. It got spooky and frightening too sometimes .. but it also showed me new things. Things about myself, about the nature of love. It led me to unexpected beauty and open vistas, things that I had never seen before.
It taught me that I was strong. It also taught me that love comes into our lives in many different ways. That the shape it takes is often not as important as being able to give and, (a hard lesson for many) receive it. In whatever form it arrives.

Yes, I hurt sometimes in the past when the relationship was new and I was very *in love*, that desperate, all encompassing NEEDY love one feels when it's all new. The genes calling you to mate & bond kinda love. I yearned for the traditional relationship (acknowledged as a couple/living together) .. and cried rivers .. but, I gradually realized that was more hormones and cultural indoctrination than it was a real need in me.
So, that made it easier to find my place in the scheme of things and accept that he is married. See the reality of my needs and that an EMR suits them.

This does not mean that the love is less or not as passionate as any other relationship.. be that a marriage or an extramarital relationship that is working towards being together as an open couple. My relationship is as real and solid as any other kind of romantic relationship. He/the relationship we have together is my anchor. Helps keep me feeling on an even keel. I have a wonderful man in my life, who treats me well and with respect. We get on well together, we have great chemistry, the relationship works well and fits my life as I want it to be. I don't want to be married. and I don't need to be acknowledged as "the official partner of". I know what we have , I'm secure in his love for me.
For me, that is not measured in outward things .. but in the solidity and realness of our feelings for each other. The knowledge that what we share is an important , life affirming, living beating heart of our personal lives. Something special that we will remember to our dying day.

Of course we have our grumbles sometimes .. we work it out, just like any relationship.
I often think it's a mistake to blame dysfunction between you on the relationship being an extramarital relationship. Yes, it's hard/frustrating to be the OP sometimes, but significant and prolonged dysfunction in a relationship is a red flag. It's a sign that communication is not working. Assigning all the blame, focusing on the extramarital aspect being the cause, is to miss important problems that will not go away or disappear, even if you do become a public couple.

So, to make a long story short. I'm a Happy OW (Other Woman). Have been for 15+ years. It is no fairytale fantasy or a 'settling for'. I am happy in my life and in a complete and fulfilling relationship. It does happen and I'd wager I'm not that unusual! Big Grin

]]>
Yes, it does happen and more often than we might think, given the large canon of accepted dogma on the subject. All promoting the stereotypical negative version of EMR's (extra marital relationship) and OP's (other person). The one we see repeated in all mainstream media and on most "support" sites for OP's.

Well, I'm here to tell you that negative cliche is not true in my case. I suspect there are many of us Happy OP's around. Why don't we hear about those ? I think because, in the main, happy, content people don't join support forums .. or they get run off/put off by the negative bias & reception given to OP's on most of those forums. Except True Support of course!

So, am I devoid of morals, empathy? Am I needy, lacking self-esteem, a bitch, a traitor to the 'sister-hood' , narcissistic, sociopath, addicted, .. err what else .. a fantasist, being used, a doormat .. on and on I could go.
The answer is NO. I'm a normal woman who fell in love. That I fell in love with a married man was my misfortune ,and, I discovered, a jewel of (self) discovery, love & delight.

I took a "road less taken" .. and like most roads less taken it went meandering, sometimes into dark, unlit spaces. It got spooky and frightening too sometimes .. but it also showed me new things. Things about myself, about the nature of love. It led me to unexpected beauty and open vistas, things that I had never seen before.
It taught me that I was strong. It also taught me that love comes into our lives in many different ways. That the shape it takes is often not as important as being able to give and, (a hard lesson for many) receive it. In whatever form it arrives.

Yes, I hurt sometimes in the past when the relationship was new and I was very *in love*, that desperate, all encompassing NEEDY love one feels when it's all new. The genes calling you to mate & bond kinda love. I yearned for the traditional relationship (acknowledged as a couple/living together) .. and cried rivers .. but, I gradually realized that was more hormones and cultural indoctrination than it was a real need in me.
So, that made it easier to find my place in the scheme of things and accept that he is married. See the reality of my needs and that an EMR suits them.

This does not mean that the love is less or not as passionate as any other relationship.. be that a marriage or an extramarital relationship that is working towards being together as an open couple. My relationship is as real and solid as any other kind of romantic relationship. He/the relationship we have together is my anchor. Helps keep me feeling on an even keel. I have a wonderful man in my life, who treats me well and with respect. We get on well together, we have great chemistry, the relationship works well and fits my life as I want it to be. I don't want to be married. and I don't need to be acknowledged as "the official partner of". I know what we have , I'm secure in his love for me.
For me, that is not measured in outward things .. but in the solidity and realness of our feelings for each other. The knowledge that what we share is an important , life affirming, living beating heart of our personal lives. Something special that we will remember to our dying day.

Of course we have our grumbles sometimes .. we work it out, just like any relationship.
I often think it's a mistake to blame dysfunction between you on the relationship being an extramarital relationship. Yes, it's hard/frustrating to be the OP sometimes, but significant and prolonged dysfunction in a relationship is a red flag. It's a sign that communication is not working. Assigning all the blame, focusing on the extramarital aspect being the cause, is to miss important problems that will not go away or disappear, even if you do become a public couple.

So, to make a long story short. I'm a Happy OW (Other Woman). Have been for 15+ years. It is no fairytale fantasy or a 'settling for'. I am happy in my life and in a complete and fulfilling relationship. It does happen and I'd wager I'm not that unusual! Big Grin

]]> <![CDATA["He Will Never Leave"]]> https://www.truesupport.org/forum/showthread.php?tid=15604 Sun, 19 Aug 2018 10:47:32 +0000 Gwen]]> https://www.truesupport.org/forum/showthread.php?tid=15604
In the beginning of our relationship I filled an empty spot in his life and his mind. I fulfilled a need that hadn't been fulfilled. There was room for me and for us without taking anything from his marriage. As time went on, our bond grew, our relationship took more and more space in his life and his emotions, until one day there was nowhere to go without starting to take away from his marriage and his wife. Our bond continued to grow stronger and stronger until there was no more room for our relationship to expand without revealing its existence to the people in his life. I had had it, I was done being the OW. Without our relationship growing stronger I could not stay in the relationship, neither could I go as I loved him. We went LC (low contact).

Simultaneously, my MM had a crisis of his own. He couldn't live with the duplicity any longer. He felt his identity threatened, he needed to stand up for who he was, who he had become. So we made an agreement that he would wait until an opportunity presented itself and then he would tell his wife about us.

He did leave. We're married today. I'm not saying this will happen to you, but if you are in the EMR because you think it's worth it today, you may get a pleasant surprise in the end.]]>
In the beginning of our relationship I filled an empty spot in his life and his mind. I fulfilled a need that hadn't been fulfilled. There was room for me and for us without taking anything from his marriage. As time went on, our bond grew, our relationship took more and more space in his life and his emotions, until one day there was nowhere to go without starting to take away from his marriage and his wife. Our bond continued to grow stronger and stronger until there was no more room for our relationship to expand without revealing its existence to the people in his life. I had had it, I was done being the OW. Without our relationship growing stronger I could not stay in the relationship, neither could I go as I loved him. We went LC (low contact).

Simultaneously, my MM had a crisis of his own. He couldn't live with the duplicity any longer. He felt his identity threatened, he needed to stand up for who he was, who he had become. So we made an agreement that he would wait until an opportunity presented itself and then he would tell his wife about us.

He did leave. We're married today. I'm not saying this will happen to you, but if you are in the EMR because you think it's worth it today, you may get a pleasant surprise in the end.]]> <![CDATA[Welcome!]]> https://www.truesupport.org/forum/showthread.php?tid=11641 Mon, 05 Dec 2016 13:41:15 +0000 Mod Team]]> https://www.truesupport.org/forum/showthread.php?tid=11641
We want to offer a safe environment where you can communicate with others who have been where you are, who understand what it is like to be a participant in an extramarital relationship. We do our utmost to preserve such an environment.

We on this forum believe that by lending support to each other, giving a listening ear, strenghtening self esteem, each individual is supported in finding a path of their own choice. Only the individual can in the end know what is best for them. We do not judge, we support.

Some of us stay in the extramarital relationship short term, some long term. Some of us end the affair, some of us end the marriage, some end both. Some of us get married to our affair partner.

Some of us are in great pain, others have gone past the decision point and are here to offer support and advice from the depth of their experiences.

The posts below are written by members of our forum, expressing how many of us women and men participating in extramarital relationships feel.

We hope you will want to join our community. Welcome!

owoman Wrote:I don't encourage people to rush out and seek As, though I don't stand in judgment of people who do. I would be a hypocrit if I did, since I did that myself and it worked very nicely for me. I don't encourage people to stay in affairs that are bad for them, just as I don't encourage people to stay in marriages that are bad for them or in any other kind of toxic relationship. To me, the dynamic of the relationship and the values of the people in it are what matters, not whether the name of the relationship has society's blessing or not. And I refuse to become reformed simply because I'm now married. I don't sell out my values because my circumstances change, and I don't look down on people who are where I was just a short while ago.

timeforchange Wrote:I've never understood the term cheerleading affairs. Ffs who of us would encourage anyone to start one? Most of us know that although there are a lot of high points to an affair there are usually many more low ones and I personally would discourage anyone from starting one! That said, I'm having one, lol, and its great to have people to discuss it with and not feel like a marriage breaking whore.

mr anderson Wrote:This might sound sexist (and I don't care if it does) but for me, a core of my masculine identity is to be a protector/provider. It has taken me awhile to see it that way but has been true since I was a boy. I don't know if its cultural or innate and really it doesn't matter. When a woman trusts me I want to be worthy of the trust. From the Boy Scouts to Superman, when the Titanic sinks its "woman and children first!", and a real man will speak reassuringly as he drowns on their behalf.

But the world is not such a simple place. And as a man I have desires and wishes and long for someone to understand me completely and to let me understand completely. One for whom I need not fear the revelation of my hidden side. Oh but to choose that! To break the trust of those that trusted you! To protect them I lie a little while the transgression is small. Talked with another woman; no big deal. Met her; a lie of omission. Kissed her, slept with her, loved her? How did I get here! Now I lie to hide the depth of the betrayal. To protect against the effect of its knowledge. To continue to provide. What kind of man betrays a woman's trust? What kind of man am I?

]]>
We want to offer a safe environment where you can communicate with others who have been where you are, who understand what it is like to be a participant in an extramarital relationship. We do our utmost to preserve such an environment.

We on this forum believe that by lending support to each other, giving a listening ear, strenghtening self esteem, each individual is supported in finding a path of their own choice. Only the individual can in the end know what is best for them. We do not judge, we support.

Some of us stay in the extramarital relationship short term, some long term. Some of us end the affair, some of us end the marriage, some end both. Some of us get married to our affair partner.

Some of us are in great pain, others have gone past the decision point and are here to offer support and advice from the depth of their experiences.

The posts below are written by members of our forum, expressing how many of us women and men participating in extramarital relationships feel.

We hope you will want to join our community. Welcome!

owoman Wrote:I don't encourage people to rush out and seek As, though I don't stand in judgment of people who do. I would be a hypocrit if I did, since I did that myself and it worked very nicely for me. I don't encourage people to stay in affairs that are bad for them, just as I don't encourage people to stay in marriages that are bad for them or in any other kind of toxic relationship. To me, the dynamic of the relationship and the values of the people in it are what matters, not whether the name of the relationship has society's blessing or not. And I refuse to become reformed simply because I'm now married. I don't sell out my values because my circumstances change, and I don't look down on people who are where I was just a short while ago.

timeforchange Wrote:I've never understood the term cheerleading affairs. Ffs who of us would encourage anyone to start one? Most of us know that although there are a lot of high points to an affair there are usually many more low ones and I personally would discourage anyone from starting one! That said, I'm having one, lol, and its great to have people to discuss it with and not feel like a marriage breaking whore.

mr anderson Wrote:This might sound sexist (and I don't care if it does) but for me, a core of my masculine identity is to be a protector/provider. It has taken me awhile to see it that way but has been true since I was a boy. I don't know if its cultural or innate and really it doesn't matter. When a woman trusts me I want to be worthy of the trust. From the Boy Scouts to Superman, when the Titanic sinks its "woman and children first!", and a real man will speak reassuringly as he drowns on their behalf.

But the world is not such a simple place. And as a man I have desires and wishes and long for someone to understand me completely and to let me understand completely. One for whom I need not fear the revelation of my hidden side. Oh but to choose that! To break the trust of those that trusted you! To protect them I lie a little while the transgression is small. Talked with another woman; no big deal. Met her; a lie of omission. Kissed her, slept with her, loved her? How did I get here! Now I lie to hide the depth of the betrayal. To protect against the effect of its knowledge. To continue to provide. What kind of man betrays a woman's trust? What kind of man am I?

]]> <![CDATA[Feeling Resentful - What Can I Do About It?]]> https://www.truesupport.org/forum/showthread.php?tid=11176 Thu, 13 Oct 2016 20:06:16 +0000 Gwen]]> https://www.truesupport.org/forum/showthread.php?tid=11176
I have been having problems with resentment. I too hate that he lives with her, sleeps with her, eats with her, watches TV with her... but I've decided that feeling resentment harms me and our relationship, so I'm trying to figure out what I can do about it. Obviously I can't suddenly start liking the situation, liking that he lives with her. That would be fooling myself. So instead I am experimenting with my emotions. Starting by just letting them be and not feeding them. It turns out I think I am actually more sad than anything.

I used to be angry a lot. A leftover from my past relationship. With Lance my anger has mellowed out and turned into sadness instead. Perhaps that's the case with my resentment too, that there is another emotion hiding underneath.

We can't make them behave like we wish they would. And we are choosing to stay in the relationship. Perhaps it is our responsibility to handle our own emotions in a way that isn't detrimental to the relationship rather than trying to change the MM.

***

What we think influences our feelings.

I was having feelings of resentment towards Lance. I could:

a) continue to let those feelings fester

b) expect him to change things so they would go away

c) end our relationship so the source of resentment would be out of my life

d) look at my thought patterns and see if by changing the way I was thinking about my situation I could minimize the resentment I was feeling.

By changing our thoughts we can change our feelings and behaviors.

I decided on option d).

I accepted that I am every day choosing to stay in a relationship with Lance. It is my own choice. He is still married and yet I am choosing to be with him. I am responsible for that choice, not he.

I decided that resentment was a feeling which was harmful to our relationship and therefore it is my responsibility to not indulge in that feeling and actively work towards not allowing myself to go there.

Lance does treat me well. I have no complaints. He is moving forward with counseling and I want to support him in that and give our relationship the best chance it has to succeed.]]>
I have been having problems with resentment. I too hate that he lives with her, sleeps with her, eats with her, watches TV with her... but I've decided that feeling resentment harms me and our relationship, so I'm trying to figure out what I can do about it. Obviously I can't suddenly start liking the situation, liking that he lives with her. That would be fooling myself. So instead I am experimenting with my emotions. Starting by just letting them be and not feeding them. It turns out I think I am actually more sad than anything.

I used to be angry a lot. A leftover from my past relationship. With Lance my anger has mellowed out and turned into sadness instead. Perhaps that's the case with my resentment too, that there is another emotion hiding underneath.

We can't make them behave like we wish they would. And we are choosing to stay in the relationship. Perhaps it is our responsibility to handle our own emotions in a way that isn't detrimental to the relationship rather than trying to change the MM.

***

What we think influences our feelings.

I was having feelings of resentment towards Lance. I could:

a) continue to let those feelings fester

b) expect him to change things so they would go away

c) end our relationship so the source of resentment would be out of my life

d) look at my thought patterns and see if by changing the way I was thinking about my situation I could minimize the resentment I was feeling.

By changing our thoughts we can change our feelings and behaviors.

I decided on option d).

I accepted that I am every day choosing to stay in a relationship with Lance. It is my own choice. He is still married and yet I am choosing to be with him. I am responsible for that choice, not he.

I decided that resentment was a feeling which was harmful to our relationship and therefore it is my responsibility to not indulge in that feeling and actively work towards not allowing myself to go there.

Lance does treat me well. I have no complaints. He is moving forward with counseling and I want to support him in that and give our relationship the best chance it has to succeed.]]> <![CDATA[It's Not Personal]]> https://www.truesupport.org/forum/showthread.php?tid=7272 Thu, 13 Aug 2015 02:47:16 +0000 Cammie01]]> https://www.truesupport.org/forum/showthread.php?tid=7272
My ex married man, who was my "one that got away", chose not to physically cheat on his wife - his choice was to tell me he loves me, doesn't trust himself if we were to see each other and we worked through a lot of things that our "lost" relationship caused for each of us. Honestly, I think his wife would be as hurt knowing the above and knowing he still wants me even though I put an end to the emotional affair and we are low contact - as she would have been had we slept together. Initially I considered her a competitor, but over time she all but disappeared in our relationship (on my end).

My married man... whole different story - but the same in that I don't see myself as second to his wife. He too chooses to have me in his life, I know we are an extramarital relationship and I know that is all we will be. I am not his wife... nope but obviously there is something missing there or he wouldn't be with me and disappointed when he can't be with me - so I am good not being his wife... We do not discuss our other relationship so I don't know why he wanted to be with me, or why he is so available, but I do know he protects the marriage (if he wants to keep me in his life, he has to keep her happy and unsuspecting). I am not the mother to his children - nope... but I respect his relationship with his children - I don't have a relationship with them, never will, but I can support him as a father. Neither of these things (wife/children) impact my self esteem - they are his responsibility not mine. The way he treats me, yes, it helps feed my new self esteem - and right now what we have is enough for me.

No relationship is a guarantee, and sometimes I think that an extramarital relationship is looked at too differently than a relationship - sure there are some differences... some issues that are inherent in an extramarital relationship but there are difficulties that come up in any relationship - no dating situation is a guarantee to a happy ending... a wedding/marriage is not a guarantee to a happily ever after.

Entering into an extramarital relationship requires an acknowledgement that the two of you have to figure things out with some need for delicacy and secrecy. Your (the general "you", someone who chooses to be in an extramarital relationship) expectations have to fit the situation - he cannot come to you at the drop of a hat, you probably cannot initiate communication whenever you want, he has other commitments that he must fulfill (legally, morally and family), he will be unavailable at times... those are just truths of an extramarital relationship. I believe that we set ourselves up (again the general "we") by expecting the married man to act as if he is not married/doesn't have other responsibilities, and when he cannot act "single" - it is seen as a personal rejection... In my head, those things have nothing to do with me, so I choose not to let them impact my self esteem.

I expect my married man to treat me with respect - he does. I tell him I know things may get canceled or shortened - "I get it", just tell me (and he always does, and he always apologizes), because I know I chose to be in this relationship with someone who has other responsibilities. I see the things he does to make time for me... if I want more (time, commitment, availability - whatever)... I have to re-examine my choice to be in a relationship with someone who is married. Each day I have a choice to continue this relationship or not... how empowering is that?

As for the possible discovery day... I know his choice now, and I don't take that personally either... I am not competing with his other commitments - I see our relationship as a complement to those things. He has no duty to me, he can walk away at any time and he knows I will walk in the opposite direction very quietly, he chooses to be with me, share himself with me and care about me. I believe if a discovery day happens, he will not stop caring about me - but he will choose to stop sharing himself with me. It will hurt me, but it will hurt him too... this is a truism of an extramarital relationship - it will most likely end. I am strong enough to handle it, when it happens...]]>
My ex married man, who was my "one that got away", chose not to physically cheat on his wife - his choice was to tell me he loves me, doesn't trust himself if we were to see each other and we worked through a lot of things that our "lost" relationship caused for each of us. Honestly, I think his wife would be as hurt knowing the above and knowing he still wants me even though I put an end to the emotional affair and we are low contact - as she would have been had we slept together. Initially I considered her a competitor, but over time she all but disappeared in our relationship (on my end).

My married man... whole different story - but the same in that I don't see myself as second to his wife. He too chooses to have me in his life, I know we are an extramarital relationship and I know that is all we will be. I am not his wife... nope but obviously there is something missing there or he wouldn't be with me and disappointed when he can't be with me - so I am good not being his wife... We do not discuss our other relationship so I don't know why he wanted to be with me, or why he is so available, but I do know he protects the marriage (if he wants to keep me in his life, he has to keep her happy and unsuspecting). I am not the mother to his children - nope... but I respect his relationship with his children - I don't have a relationship with them, never will, but I can support him as a father. Neither of these things (wife/children) impact my self esteem - they are his responsibility not mine. The way he treats me, yes, it helps feed my new self esteem - and right now what we have is enough for me.

No relationship is a guarantee, and sometimes I think that an extramarital relationship is looked at too differently than a relationship - sure there are some differences... some issues that are inherent in an extramarital relationship but there are difficulties that come up in any relationship - no dating situation is a guarantee to a happy ending... a wedding/marriage is not a guarantee to a happily ever after.

Entering into an extramarital relationship requires an acknowledgement that the two of you have to figure things out with some need for delicacy and secrecy. Your (the general "you", someone who chooses to be in an extramarital relationship) expectations have to fit the situation - he cannot come to you at the drop of a hat, you probably cannot initiate communication whenever you want, he has other commitments that he must fulfill (legally, morally and family), he will be unavailable at times... those are just truths of an extramarital relationship. I believe that we set ourselves up (again the general "we") by expecting the married man to act as if he is not married/doesn't have other responsibilities, and when he cannot act "single" - it is seen as a personal rejection... In my head, those things have nothing to do with me, so I choose not to let them impact my self esteem.

I expect my married man to treat me with respect - he does. I tell him I know things may get canceled or shortened - "I get it", just tell me (and he always does, and he always apologizes), because I know I chose to be in this relationship with someone who has other responsibilities. I see the things he does to make time for me... if I want more (time, commitment, availability - whatever)... I have to re-examine my choice to be in a relationship with someone who is married. Each day I have a choice to continue this relationship or not... how empowering is that?

As for the possible discovery day... I know his choice now, and I don't take that personally either... I am not competing with his other commitments - I see our relationship as a complement to those things. He has no duty to me, he can walk away at any time and he knows I will walk in the opposite direction very quietly, he chooses to be with me, share himself with me and care about me. I believe if a discovery day happens, he will not stop caring about me - but he will choose to stop sharing himself with me. It will hurt me, but it will hurt him too... this is a truism of an extramarital relationship - it will most likely end. I am strong enough to handle it, when it happens...]]> <![CDATA[Unexpected Silences]]> https://www.truesupport.org/forum/showthread.php?tid=6690 Sat, 27 Jun 2015 14:40:45 +0000 Irene Adler]]> https://www.truesupport.org/forum/showthread.php?tid=6690
Those awful unexpected silences can feel very upsetting , very frustrating & very hurtful. They can make the monkeys ( your inner fears & insecurities , your triggers ) go berserk.
I often read that people think the MP is doing this because they want to push you away, force you to leave or because they see you as a low priority convenience to be taken out only when they feel the need.
I do not think this is often ( if ever ) the case. I do think that it is exactly how it makes you feel.

I think it's important you should (keep) telling them that. Tell them that it is slowly ( or maybe speedily ) destroying the R. because those phone calls/emails/txts etc are the life blood of your R. They help you to feel important, connected & like the R matters to the AP. That silence is THE killer. That you need x number of communications per week to feel secure & OK in the R.

I also think it is *very* important to keep your expectations realistic. Try to make the number you ask for a compromise between what you want & what they can provide.
Remember that they do not have the same life you do. No matter how much they may think about you & long for you, if they are finding it difficult all it shows is that , at the moment , as their life is at the moment , they find it very hard to make regular/frequent contact.

Being busy can be a reason for not communicating. Days can fly by & it can come as a surprise that 7 or 10 days have gone by , when you thought it was only 3 or 4. It's certainly happened to me.
Add to that , that they can not always contact you when they want to .. they have a BS & a home life to contend with.
Yes, that IS their baby to rock .. but , the reality is that it WILL interfere with their ability to contact you.

Mr.H ( my MM ) & I only communicate once or twice a week. Many on my old board & probably here too , feel that is not enough. Mr.H & I wrangled long & hard about it. I wanted more & felt all the feelings I have mentioned above.
I wrote & talked about it many a time with him. He would make an effort & then fall back again. I started to feel like he just couldn't be bothered BUT I knew from when we met & his emails that he did care & was sincere in his feelings for me .. & I realized I was experiencing a cognitive dissonance.

So, I thought long & hard about WHY it made me feel so bad. Why I was interpreting it as I was. For me , it was because I felt insecure in the R. & in Mr.H's feelings for me .. & the unexpected silences fed that feeling.
So, I tackled that problem. I asked Mr.H what my place was in his life. I asked if he loved me & I told him how his unexpected silences made me feel.
I told him what I needed to feel secure & safe in the R. Not all in one sentence of course .. but during the course of one conversation.
I also let him speak. I listened to what he told me. Listened to why he said he was sometimes late emailing me & how he felt about me , the R & his occasional tardiness.

I trusted in his feelings for me. I overlooked the odd overrun if he was late emailing me ..I tried not to interpret every silence as a personal rebuff. Not to over-think and/or 2nd guess every word said or not said & I began to concentrate on the positives the R brought to my life.

I know how important those virtual contacts are & I do understand how bad unexpected silences can make you feel. But, there are many things you can do to combat those feelings. The things I've mentioned above helped me.

I'd also like to say a few words about norms & realistic expectations when it comes to the amount of contact in an EMR. Not all couples have daily contact. That does not make your R any the less committed or mean that your MP loves you less. It does not make your R 'less than' those that do.
Being in an EMR means that the AP will have to be discreet if you are to avoid a Dday. It also means that there will be times ( sometimes unexpected ) when they cannot be contacted or contact you.
Every R ,so every EMR too, has it's own unique dynamic. This depends on the personalities/needs/wants & opportunities open to both parties.
When it comes to contact in an EMR ,it will be particularly the MP who determines the amount & timing of contact .. precisely because they are M.

Finally, for me, quantity does not necessarily mean quality. Chit-chat is nice & good .. but does not a deep connection make. Sometimes less is more ..
So, if your MP is not contacting you multiple times a day/week .. don't feel that you or your R are somehow less than or that they do not love you. Rather , look to what the quality of the contact is. Do you have fun. Does it have meaning for both of you. Do they respond to your questions. Does the contact add to your R and/or your day. Does it cheer you. Do you both enjoy it.
Of course not all those things have to happen all the time .. just in general.

Having said all that .. I do know just how upsetting & hurtful unexpected silences can feel. Stay true to your bottom line. Try to honor your own boundaries. Don't beat yourself up if you find that hard. You are not superhuman. We all need time to do the hard stuff .. some never get there .. that's just the way it is .. there is no shame in it. We all do the best we can , given the place we are in, in our life, at that time in our life. Pick yourself up, dust yourself off & try again. Life is not a level path along a fixed route .. relationships certainly aren't. It's only by navigating the bumps, the falls, the twists & the hurts that we grow in confidence & learn. There is no shame in falling & there is no shame in failing .. it's all a part of learning & growing.]]>
Those awful unexpected silences can feel very upsetting , very frustrating & very hurtful. They can make the monkeys ( your inner fears & insecurities , your triggers ) go berserk.
I often read that people think the MP is doing this because they want to push you away, force you to leave or because they see you as a low priority convenience to be taken out only when they feel the need.
I do not think this is often ( if ever ) the case. I do think that it is exactly how it makes you feel.

I think it's important you should (keep) telling them that. Tell them that it is slowly ( or maybe speedily ) destroying the R. because those phone calls/emails/txts etc are the life blood of your R. They help you to feel important, connected & like the R matters to the AP. That silence is THE killer. That you need x number of communications per week to feel secure & OK in the R.

I also think it is *very* important to keep your expectations realistic. Try to make the number you ask for a compromise between what you want & what they can provide.
Remember that they do not have the same life you do. No matter how much they may think about you & long for you, if they are finding it difficult all it shows is that , at the moment , as their life is at the moment , they find it very hard to make regular/frequent contact.

Being busy can be a reason for not communicating. Days can fly by & it can come as a surprise that 7 or 10 days have gone by , when you thought it was only 3 or 4. It's certainly happened to me.
Add to that , that they can not always contact you when they want to .. they have a BS & a home life to contend with.
Yes, that IS their baby to rock .. but , the reality is that it WILL interfere with their ability to contact you.

Mr.H ( my MM ) & I only communicate once or twice a week. Many on my old board & probably here too , feel that is not enough. Mr.H & I wrangled long & hard about it. I wanted more & felt all the feelings I have mentioned above.
I wrote & talked about it many a time with him. He would make an effort & then fall back again. I started to feel like he just couldn't be bothered BUT I knew from when we met & his emails that he did care & was sincere in his feelings for me .. & I realized I was experiencing a cognitive dissonance.

So, I thought long & hard about WHY it made me feel so bad. Why I was interpreting it as I was. For me , it was because I felt insecure in the R. & in Mr.H's feelings for me .. & the unexpected silences fed that feeling.
So, I tackled that problem. I asked Mr.H what my place was in his life. I asked if he loved me & I told him how his unexpected silences made me feel.
I told him what I needed to feel secure & safe in the R. Not all in one sentence of course .. but during the course of one conversation.
I also let him speak. I listened to what he told me. Listened to why he said he was sometimes late emailing me & how he felt about me , the R & his occasional tardiness.

I trusted in his feelings for me. I overlooked the odd overrun if he was late emailing me ..I tried not to interpret every silence as a personal rebuff. Not to over-think and/or 2nd guess every word said or not said & I began to concentrate on the positives the R brought to my life.

I know how important those virtual contacts are & I do understand how bad unexpected silences can make you feel. But, there are many things you can do to combat those feelings. The things I've mentioned above helped me.

I'd also like to say a few words about norms & realistic expectations when it comes to the amount of contact in an EMR. Not all couples have daily contact. That does not make your R any the less committed or mean that your MP loves you less. It does not make your R 'less than' those that do.
Being in an EMR means that the AP will have to be discreet if you are to avoid a Dday. It also means that there will be times ( sometimes unexpected ) when they cannot be contacted or contact you.
Every R ,so every EMR too, has it's own unique dynamic. This depends on the personalities/needs/wants & opportunities open to both parties.
When it comes to contact in an EMR ,it will be particularly the MP who determines the amount & timing of contact .. precisely because they are M.

Finally, for me, quantity does not necessarily mean quality. Chit-chat is nice & good .. but does not a deep connection make. Sometimes less is more ..
So, if your MP is not contacting you multiple times a day/week .. don't feel that you or your R are somehow less than or that they do not love you. Rather , look to what the quality of the contact is. Do you have fun. Does it have meaning for both of you. Do they respond to your questions. Does the contact add to your R and/or your day. Does it cheer you. Do you both enjoy it.
Of course not all those things have to happen all the time .. just in general.

Having said all that .. I do know just how upsetting & hurtful unexpected silences can feel. Stay true to your bottom line. Try to honor your own boundaries. Don't beat yourself up if you find that hard. You are not superhuman. We all need time to do the hard stuff .. some never get there .. that's just the way it is .. there is no shame in it. We all do the best we can , given the place we are in, in our life, at that time in our life. Pick yourself up, dust yourself off & try again. Life is not a level path along a fixed route .. relationships certainly aren't. It's only by navigating the bumps, the falls, the twists & the hurts that we grow in confidence & learn. There is no shame in falling & there is no shame in failing .. it's all a part of learning & growing.]]> <![CDATA[TS - A Forum for the WS, MOP and OP]]> https://www.truesupport.org/forum/showthread.php?tid=6095 Sun, 15 Mar 2015 06:55:01 +0000 Jen_admin]]> https://www.truesupport.org/forum/showthread.php?tid=6095
One challenge the other men/women meet is to focus on themselves rather than on the married woman/man they are in a relationship with. This is true in real life and this is true on the forum. It's like with the wife of an alcoholic. It's detrimental for her to focus on getting him sober. Let's not focus on getting our own or someone else's married woman/man to leave their marriage.

True Support is a place for self-discovery, for sharing our experiences, for working on our own process of evolving on our path through life. Let's leave space for everyone on our forum to discover their own truths rather than try selling them ours.]]>
One challenge the other men/women meet is to focus on themselves rather than on the married woman/man they are in a relationship with. This is true in real life and this is true on the forum. It's like with the wife of an alcoholic. It's detrimental for her to focus on getting him sober. Let's not focus on getting our own or someone else's married woman/man to leave their marriage.

True Support is a place for self-discovery, for sharing our experiences, for working on our own process of evolving on our path through life. Let's leave space for everyone on our forum to discover their own truths rather than try selling them ours.]]> <![CDATA[He said goodbye to us...now what?]]> https://www.truesupport.org/forum/showthread.php?tid=3997 Tue, 17 Jun 2014 17:29:23 +0000 RollerCoaster]]> https://www.truesupport.org/forum/showthread.php?tid=3997
Our relationship was innocent at first. Lunch once a month turned into lunch once a week then eventually became seeking out time to see each other as frequently as possible. Texting turned into a kiss, which turned to more. My world became him. I was head-over-heels in love with him until it all changed.

"I need to try and work on my marriage."

Those words ripped a hole in my heart so huge I thought I would die. My world collapsed and I couldn't breathe. I literally felt as if he had killed me with those nine little words.

I shut down. The man who made me open up my heart to him...the first person since we parted so many years ago...was ripping it out. Nothing made sense.

I wanted to see him. He said it was too soon. I NEEDED to see him. The ache was too powerful, the sense of utter loss was blinding. I couldn't function at work, at home, or with my friends. My world had collapsed around me and there was no saving me.

The only thing that helped me carry on was True Support. I had the folks here to lean on when I couldn't carry on by myself. Being in an extramarital relationship is hard enough. But combine that with the inability to talk to anyone about what's going on and it's a recipe for disaster. Here, I've found a safe place to land. A place where I can talk to others who have "been there, done that" and lived to tell the tale. And there are some, like me, who are going through their relationships without the benefit of a manual on how to do so. The support I've received here has been nothing short of life saving for me.

We are a family of men and women who are willing participants in extramarital relationships. Or have been in an extramarital relationship and have come out the other side. Still others are in relationships which have developed into happy marriages and committed partnerships. We are here to support each other, not to judge or to preach. And we don't bash.

If this is your kind of place, we invite you to join us.]]>
Our relationship was innocent at first. Lunch once a month turned into lunch once a week then eventually became seeking out time to see each other as frequently as possible. Texting turned into a kiss, which turned to more. My world became him. I was head-over-heels in love with him until it all changed.

"I need to try and work on my marriage."

Those words ripped a hole in my heart so huge I thought I would die. My world collapsed and I couldn't breathe. I literally felt as if he had killed me with those nine little words.

I shut down. The man who made me open up my heart to him...the first person since we parted so many years ago...was ripping it out. Nothing made sense.

I wanted to see him. He said it was too soon. I NEEDED to see him. The ache was too powerful, the sense of utter loss was blinding. I couldn't function at work, at home, or with my friends. My world had collapsed around me and there was no saving me.

The only thing that helped me carry on was True Support. I had the folks here to lean on when I couldn't carry on by myself. Being in an extramarital relationship is hard enough. But combine that with the inability to talk to anyone about what's going on and it's a recipe for disaster. Here, I've found a safe place to land. A place where I can talk to others who have "been there, done that" and lived to tell the tale. And there are some, like me, who are going through their relationships without the benefit of a manual on how to do so. The support I've received here has been nothing short of life saving for me.

We are a family of men and women who are willing participants in extramarital relationships. Or have been in an extramarital relationship and have come out the other side. Still others are in relationships which have developed into happy marriages and committed partnerships. We are here to support each other, not to judge or to preach. And we don't bash.

If this is your kind of place, we invite you to join us.]]> <![CDATA[My Choice(s)]]> https://www.truesupport.org/forum/showthread.php?tid=3625 Thu, 01 May 2014 22:08:31 +0000 Cammie01]]> https://www.truesupport.org/forum/showthread.php?tid=3625
The power of choice for the movement of the relationship does not belong to the married person alone. The relationship moving forward or not should not be based solely on the married person's wants/needs/desires/marital status. The other person cannot forget to be active participants in their own life. Yes, the married person has another to go home to, to share another part of his/her life with. If the other woman/man is single, the difference between their "home" situations is obvious but shouldn't impact the power of choice for either of them. In my opinion, only if the married person hides the fact that he/she is married to the other person, is there a power differential in choices, and that would be a topic for a very different post. If I am honest with my partner about what I want and need from the relationship, then it is my responsibility to evaluate his actions (or lack of) to see if we are on the same page. This is the great equalizer.

In that way, an extramarital relationship is no different than any other type of relationship. If the married man says he will leave by X date or promises if there is a discovery day that he will choose me- I can only base my belief in his words on his actions - both past and present. If he says these things but makes no move to begin an exit strategy or there is a discovery day and he chooses to stay married, I too have a decision to make. None of these decisions are easy, they certainly don't come without pain, but if I choose to stay in a relationship, I cannot blame my partner for my decision.

Ending a romantic relationship is rarely easy, it is often a painful decision to make. Not choosing to end a romantic relationship can be painful as well. Sometimes it may feel as if there is no easier solution - but we "others" should never forget we have the same choice as our married partners in our relationships.]]>
The power of choice for the movement of the relationship does not belong to the married person alone. The relationship moving forward or not should not be based solely on the married person's wants/needs/desires/marital status. The other person cannot forget to be active participants in their own life. Yes, the married person has another to go home to, to share another part of his/her life with. If the other woman/man is single, the difference between their "home" situations is obvious but shouldn't impact the power of choice for either of them. In my opinion, only if the married person hides the fact that he/she is married to the other person, is there a power differential in choices, and that would be a topic for a very different post. If I am honest with my partner about what I want and need from the relationship, then it is my responsibility to evaluate his actions (or lack of) to see if we are on the same page. This is the great equalizer.

In that way, an extramarital relationship is no different than any other type of relationship. If the married man says he will leave by X date or promises if there is a discovery day that he will choose me- I can only base my belief in his words on his actions - both past and present. If he says these things but makes no move to begin an exit strategy or there is a discovery day and he chooses to stay married, I too have a decision to make. None of these decisions are easy, they certainly don't come without pain, but if I choose to stay in a relationship, I cannot blame my partner for my decision.

Ending a romantic relationship is rarely easy, it is often a painful decision to make. Not choosing to end a romantic relationship can be painful as well. Sometimes it may feel as if there is no easier solution - but we "others" should never forget we have the same choice as our married partners in our relationships.]]> <![CDATA[Who me? A Wayward Committed Person AND the Other Woman?]]> https://www.truesupport.org/forum/showthread.php?tid=3481 Tue, 08 Apr 2014 23:38:45 +0000 Cammie01]]> https://www.truesupport.org/forum/showthread.php?tid=3481
How did I get here? I was a betrayed spouse and while I didn't understand how "one woman can do that to another", I always held him responsible for ch---ing. For a multitude of reasons, we divorced.

Now, years later I found I can answer that question above - and the answer is I am not doing anything to another woman. I fell in love with her husband, so anything I did was within my relationship with him. We were friends who (through email only) fell in love with each other - fighting it all the way, taking breaks from communication trying to control the feelings and finally accepting it was what it was, an emotional affair. Do I feel I did anything "to" his wife? No, to be very honest, we shared all of our lives with each other, and yet I still always considered her a non-entity in our relationship (please see the thread "Love Triangle or Parallel Relationships?"). I knew many of their problems, although I was careful never to complain to my married man about my significant other, because that felt like a HUGE betrayal to me (betrayal of my SO). Quite honestly, my married man fully supported my relationship with SO and said he felt SO was the best man for me, and he would at times let me know why he thought SO was better for me. Weird, yes, but we were friends first, we were friends through the emotional affair and swore our friendship would last even beyond the emotional affair. (To be determined)

From this perspective, I find that I struggle with both sides of an affair, the other woman and the wayward committed person. I struggled with wanting more from him and on the other side, with the lies and deception that hiding something from your partner causes. I judged myself from society's perspective of both of these roles - was I a bad person because I loved a married man? How could I love two people, while in a 15 year committed, living together relationship? Was this really love for the married man? We "only" communicated via email and NEVER on weekends, how could this possibly be considered an affair? How could I, who after coming through some significant issues vowed to live an honest and true life, find myself in a deceptive relationship with my SO while being more honest with my married man? That realization really shook me to the core.

So, yes, that's where I am: I am in love with one man and I love another. I chose to continue the emotional affair, knowing my life partner is someone else. I did nothing to his wife, anything that this relationship does to her is his responsibility just as anything that the relationship does to SO is fully and completely my responsibility. I have only accepted his love because he chose to give it to me.]]>
How did I get here? I was a betrayed spouse and while I didn't understand how "one woman can do that to another", I always held him responsible for ch---ing. For a multitude of reasons, we divorced.

Now, years later I found I can answer that question above - and the answer is I am not doing anything to another woman. I fell in love with her husband, so anything I did was within my relationship with him. We were friends who (through email only) fell in love with each other - fighting it all the way, taking breaks from communication trying to control the feelings and finally accepting it was what it was, an emotional affair. Do I feel I did anything "to" his wife? No, to be very honest, we shared all of our lives with each other, and yet I still always considered her a non-entity in our relationship (please see the thread "Love Triangle or Parallel Relationships?"). I knew many of their problems, although I was careful never to complain to my married man about my significant other, because that felt like a HUGE betrayal to me (betrayal of my SO). Quite honestly, my married man fully supported my relationship with SO and said he felt SO was the best man for me, and he would at times let me know why he thought SO was better for me. Weird, yes, but we were friends first, we were friends through the emotional affair and swore our friendship would last even beyond the emotional affair. (To be determined)

From this perspective, I find that I struggle with both sides of an affair, the other woman and the wayward committed person. I struggled with wanting more from him and on the other side, with the lies and deception that hiding something from your partner causes. I judged myself from society's perspective of both of these roles - was I a bad person because I loved a married man? How could I love two people, while in a 15 year committed, living together relationship? Was this really love for the married man? We "only" communicated via email and NEVER on weekends, how could this possibly be considered an affair? How could I, who after coming through some significant issues vowed to live an honest and true life, find myself in a deceptive relationship with my SO while being more honest with my married man? That realization really shook me to the core.

So, yes, that's where I am: I am in love with one man and I love another. I chose to continue the emotional affair, knowing my life partner is someone else. I did nothing to his wife, anything that this relationship does to her is his responsibility just as anything that the relationship does to SO is fully and completely my responsibility. I have only accepted his love because he chose to give it to me.]]> <![CDATA[Choices]]> https://www.truesupport.org/forum/showthread.php?tid=3439 Sat, 29 Mar 2014 15:56:06 +0000 will-ow]]> https://www.truesupport.org/forum/showthread.php?tid=3439 As you read the different threads here you'll get to know some of us and realise that no 2 EMRs are the same. One common theme comes through over and over again though - we choose to be in these relationships.

I chose to be an OW. I entered into an EMR with a married man knowing full well he had no intention of leaving his wife.
Sometimes it hurts like hell and I wish I'd never done it, but it was my choice - it is noone else's responsibility or fault.
That doesn't make me a bad person or a victim. I'm just a person with free will who chose to enter into a relationship with a married man and fell in love with him.

Its not always easy - it may be a cliche but we talk about the "rollercoaster" for good reason. On less-good days I try to remind myself that I chose this, and that the good times and feelings way outweigh the difficult ones (for now anyway).
If or when our R ends, it may end badly. Maybe I'll feel betrayed, like I've been thrown under the bus, or maybe I will have chosen to walk away. However messy it gets, however much it hurts though, I do know it can never change what we have now - this amazing, fun, loving relationship I chose to be part of.
And I know that I will be able to call on this amazing group of people to help me through it Smile

You've landed in a safe, supportive space here - Welcome to our forum!]]> As you read the different threads here you'll get to know some of us and realise that no 2 EMRs are the same. One common theme comes through over and over again though - we choose to be in these relationships.

I chose to be an OW. I entered into an EMR with a married man knowing full well he had no intention of leaving his wife.
Sometimes it hurts like hell and I wish I'd never done it, but it was my choice - it is noone else's responsibility or fault.
That doesn't make me a bad person or a victim. I'm just a person with free will who chose to enter into a relationship with a married man and fell in love with him.

Its not always easy - it may be a cliche but we talk about the "rollercoaster" for good reason. On less-good days I try to remind myself that I chose this, and that the good times and feelings way outweigh the difficult ones (for now anyway).
If or when our R ends, it may end badly. Maybe I'll feel betrayed, like I've been thrown under the bus, or maybe I will have chosen to walk away. However messy it gets, however much it hurts though, I do know it can never change what we have now - this amazing, fun, loving relationship I chose to be part of.
And I know that I will be able to call on this amazing group of people to help me through it Smile

You've landed in a safe, supportive space here - Welcome to our forum!]]>